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Contributor
oestrada
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎10-26-2008
0 Kudos

When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?

Would be nice to know so that we (the customer) can make plans on purchasing of new computers and such. g and b are not cutting it anymore...just my humble opinion.

Platinum Contributor I
Hubrisnxs
Posts: 5,668
Registered: ‎07-22-2009

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?

I wouldn't expect anytime soon, I hear they are reserving those for the 150mb customers since they actually need it for the gb lan ports 

 

but who knows,  they introduced them in june, but haven't deployed them and I remember reading that it was for the reason above.     you're truly better off just buying a n router.  trendnet has wireless models that are pretty cheap.   and trendnet are real solid routers

Contributor
oestrada
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎10-26-2008
0 Kudos

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?

hey thanks for the info. I'll look into that.

Gold Contributor I
spacedebris
Posts: 1,692
Registered: ‎05-17-2009

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?

Actually the N routers are already deployed and out there.

 

The problem is that Verizon does not support wireless or internal networking. Therefore as far as they are concerned there is no difference between G and N. The only reason they are getting N is they cant buy the G anymore. So all the new routers that they purchase are N.

 

Can you request one?  NO

Can you get one?  Maybe  BIG stress on maybe. The way Verizon does this is that all the routers are on a shelf and what ever they grab is what you get. They cannot even tell from the packaging as to which one is in the box. So it is completely luck of the draw.

Will it change the support from Verizon?  ABSOLUTELY NO!! Verizon supports wireless for 10 feet or line of site. Which ever is LESS.  Beyond that, your on your own.

 

 

 

In short, If you want N wireless, your better off going out and getting your own WAP to add to the verizon system and do it yourself.




====================================================================================

Error exists between keyboard and chair.
Copper Contributor
mschauber
Posts: 20
Registered: ‎07-09-2010

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?


spacedebris wrote:

Actually the N routers are already deployed and out there.

 

The problem is that Verizon does not support wireless or internal networking. Therefore as far as they are concerned there is no difference between G and N. The only reason they are getting N is they can't buy the G anymore. So all the new routers that they purchase are N.

 

Can you request one?  NO

Can you get one?  Maybe  BIG stress on maybe. The way Verizon does this is that all the routers are on a shelf and what ever they grab is what you get. They cannot even tell from the packaging as to which one is in the box. So it is completely luck of the draw.

Will it change the support from Verizon?  ABSOLUTELY NO!! Verizon supports wireless for 10 feet or line of site. Which ever is LESS.  Beyond that, your on your own.

 

 

 

In short, If you want N wireless, your better off going out and getting your own WAP to add to the Verizon system and do it yourself.


  1. Rev F routers DO have 802.11n.  BUT, they are not MIMO*.  Were you to buy a reputable 802.11n device, it will most likely have 2, 3 or 4 antennae (can be internal or external.)  This allows the device to function with the MIMO* specifications providing up to 300 Mbps.  Without MIMO*, Rev F (I'm not sure if Rev E has 802.11n) maxes out at 150 Mbps.
  2. You can request any router you want, but whether they tell you or not, ONLY the sales department can get an actual request on the paperwork sent to the warehouse.  And the sales people won't do it unless you upgrade your service to the 100/35 overpriced asymmetrical service.
  3. While it is true that the router packaging does not distinguish revisions, it does list the firmware version.  And, if you take a look at: Actiontec Current Firmware Versions you will see in the Verizon column that Rev G clearly has a different firmware version than Rev E/F, which clearly have a different firmware version than Rev A/C/D.  So they COULD, if Verizon cared about their existing customers enough, have the requested router rev sent out.
  4. Supporting wireless is very difficult.  And when you have a cast of thousands, most of whom have never felt the ground that these United States occupy, you can't expect them to do anything other than insure the wireless is functioning on the router they provide.  Consider just a couple of the hundreds of issues to check when working with wireless: 1) Microwave and florescent lights emit 2.4ghz waves, affecting wireless. 2) A home built in 1930 probably have walls made with cement and an interlacing steel support, NOT good for wireless transmission.  3) While 5ghz is better, 2.4ghz dies when it enters water.  So might you have a fish tank?  May there be people sitting/standing in the way (human body is made up of 97% H20 (everyday water.)  If you don't believe me, one day try standing in front of the WLAN antenna, with it pointing to at you and stand about 10-12" away.  Then have someone check the signal strength on a computer that is in line with the antenna and yourself, it will close to, if not, zero. (This will only be a good indication if it's a single antenna device, like the Actiontec Rev E/F.) 4) Interference from other networks.  Many of us live in highly populated areas.  When I do a scan for wireless networks using a Cisco A/G/N card, I can see ~115 networks.  Yes, 115.  I live in a 40 story residential building which shares the block with a 60 story commercial building, not to mention all the other residential and commercial buildings around me in New York City.  Finding a 2.4ghz channel that is clear is literally impossible.  Due to the wave structure of the 2.4ghz frequency, only channels 1, 6 & 11 are usable.  Why manufactures insist on setting their devices to auto and including all 11 channels is beyond me.  If they want to set them to auto, it should be an Auto (1/6/11) option.  So if you don't have or don't want to buy a dual band or 5ghz WAP, you need to manually select one of these three channels and find the one that gives you the best performance. 5) Every manufacturer of wireless NICs, uses slightly different specs.  So I could have a DLink wireless NIC and a Netgear wireless NIC in the same computer, same location, (obviously one at a time,) and get totally different results.

----- So, as you can see, expecting wireless support is really not reasonable.  Wireless survey experts, of which I am one for Cisco, get paid very handsomely to think about all these variables and find the nooks and crannies and insure complete coverage.  One small piece of advice.  If you live in an apartment or small house, something under 1000 sq ft, try reducing the power output of the router.  Think about the power level as your voice.  If it's too low, no one can hear you, but if you're screaming at the top of your lungs at someone a couple of feat away, they will hear you but probably not understand what you are saying.

 

* The key to this speed is MIMO (multiple input/multiple output) which uses multiple antennas to send and receive digital data in multiple simultaneous radio streams, thus multiplying total performance.

 

 

And, if you are looking for a low cost/high powered wireless solution without using the one Verizon provides, I recommend the Netgear WNDR3700.  Out of the box you are virtually guaranteed to see a huge performance gain.  If you tweak the Netgear firmware you can make it even better and if you like to tinker, head over to dd-wrt.com and spend some time reading through the forums and consider using their free GPL firmware.  The functionality will blow your mind, you can even create a wifi hotspot complete with a payment system and advertising, if you'd like to make some money off your friends and family:smileywink:  Of course, keep in mind, it is illegal to resale Verizon internet services as well as services from most other broadband providers.  But that feature aside, it's dual band so you can separate your speed eaters like video off onto the 5.4ghz band and keep you basic web browsing on the 2.4ghz band.  You can setup less secure guest networks to make it easy for your guests to get on the internet.  (Keep in mind companies like apple, Samsung, LG, Sony haven't embraced the 5.4ghz band yet, so don't expect to stream that movie you have on an I(fill in your choice) device to a device on the 5.4ghz network.

Platinum Contributor I
Hubrisnxs
Posts: 5,668
Registered: ‎07-22-2009
0 Kudos

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?

rev h will be the residential version of the rev G and is not out yet anywhere. the rev g is still being sent to 100MB + customers, and the tech's giving rev g to new customers are not doing so inside of verizon policy.   

 

when I called and talked to a sup they were very explicit about the policy and that those reps giving g's to customers were operating well outside of procedure and implied it was risky for them to do so. 

Contributor
Kevin224
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎01-11-2011
0 Kudos

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?

So the announcement that FiOS will be offering 802.11N routers in the Summer of 2010 was incorrect?  Also, are you saying an 802.11G router will eventually be upgraded to 802.11N via firmware?  I didn't think that was possible.

Gold Contributor I
lasagna
Posts: 1,788
Registered: ‎05-27-2010
Plan: Prime HD 50/25
Location: South Central, PA

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?

I think the answer will be ... when you need an 802.11n router in order to be able to leverage Verizon's services, then they will have to provide one.   Reality is, with the maximum residential service for most individuals capped at 35/35 and many individuals selecting 25/25 or 15/5 packages, 802.11n is simply not required for access to Verizon's services at the maximum rated speed.  In the 100/50 space, well now, that's a different issue and I suspect that's where you see these devices going initially.

 

Now, some individuals can certainly make use of this bandwidth for their own personal home networks -- but that's not a Verizon access issue and I suspect the reason why you don't see any move to replace the current set of routers.   The reality is, the MoCA router is a rather expensive device to replace in the field and I'm certain folks don't want to be paying the likely increase in cost across the board that would be required to replace routers unnecessarily from a service standpoint.

 

Certainly over time, the fleet of current 802.11g routers will age out due to failures and as Verizon restocks they would certainly be buying current generation routers to backfill.   But I just don't see them going out an proactively replacing routers at customer sites -- any way you look at it, replacing a working router with another working router just adds cost to the bottom line and doesn't make sense from a business standpoint.   And I certainly don't want my bill increasing to provide it to everyone -- including a large set of individuals who don't need it.

 

As I've done, and have encouraged others to do, why "expect" Verizon to provide this for you?   An 802.11n residential router (or access point) can be obtained and installed in conjunction with the Verizon router -- giving you direct control over the speed and configuration of your home network.   You control your own destiny and the Verizon router merely provides the conduit services to the capped internet speeds -- which it is more than capable of handling.

 

 

 

 

Contributor
sryu
Posts: 5
Registered: ‎08-09-2011
0 Kudos

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?

[ Edited ]

Here is a recent chat session which was abruptly terminated by the agent after 1+ hour. leading nowhere....  

It may look long and messy, but reading through it for a few minutes will save you an hour of your time. If anybody got a better outcome on the issue, please let me know!

 

Chat Subject: Slow ThroughputYour Question: Our internet connection deteriorates significantly recently, and I need 802.11n capable unit, as the current unit (802.11b) seems it interferes with all kinds of our other wireless machines.A Verizon Service Representative will be with you shortly. Thank you. (12:36:18)Agent Abhishek has joined. (12:36:29)Abhishek : Chat ID for this session is 08091196521. (12:36:29)Abhishek(12:36:33): Thank you for contacting Verizon HSI Technical Support. My name is Abhishek and I am the technical support analyst assigned to help you. Please stay online for a few moments while I review the information generated by your trouble ticket.Abhishek(12:38:39): Thank you for staying online with me.Abhishek(12:38:44): Let me know that do you have FiOS or HSI services with Verizon?sryu(12:38:53): FiOSAbhishek(12:39:19): Thank you for the information and please be online, as if I am transferring you to the FiOS technical chat queue because you are having FiOS services with us.This session is being transferred. (12:39:34)This session is transferred to Brandon. (12:39:44)Agent Brandon has joined. (12:39:44)Brandon(12:40:12): Thank you for using Verizon technical support live chat, my name is Brandon.sryu(12:40:29): hiBrandon(12:40:41): you are in mass?sryu(12:40:45): yesBrandon(12:40:51): Unfortunately I do not have access to the information for your region. Bear with me while I transfer you to the support group that currently handles your areasryu(12:41:00): okThis session is being transferred. (12:41:06)This session is transferred to Angelica. (12:41:11)Agent Angelica has joined. (12:41:11)Angelica(12:41:16): Thank you for using Verizon FiOS Technical Support. My name is Angelica, for security purposes please post the name, address, and telephone number on the account as well as a good can be reached telephone number [ personal info excised... ] Angelica(12:43:39): While I access your account and start running some diagnostic tests, please open a new browser window and type http://www.verizon.com/inhomeagent in the address bar and follow the prompts to download our new In Home Agent which is a free useful tool that installs on your computer and can assist you with resolving issues with internet connectivity, email configuration, resetting your set top box, programming your remote and much more, if you've not already done so.Angelica(12:43:58): After our chat session is completed, I would like to send you a onetime e-mail containing tips and links to some of our great self help tools including the Verizon In Home Agent software. Do you have any other question?Angelica(12:44:09): I apologize, Do you have an email I can send this information to?sryu(12:44:37):  [excised] Angelica(12:46:08): Thank youAngelica(12:46:14): I'm sorry for any frustration this has caused, but I'd be glad to assist you with your issue today.Angelica(12:47:41): Mr. Ryu are you getting a low signal, is this what you mean by connection deteriorating?sryu(12:48:18): Low signal is part of the problem in my study room. Used to be fine, but now, I often have the issue.Angelica(12:48:59): Is this happening only through wireless connections?sryu(12:49:40): Yes. We only use the wireless, because of the restrictions of the house room arrangements..Angelica(12:54:16): I understand, one thing to keep in mind is the signal from the router is a 2.4 GHz radio signal, if let say the router is in room A where the router is and the wireless PC is in room B the next over but line of site wise between the 2 is a metal filing cabinet then the signal will refract or bounce off the metal and you will have dead zones like a cell service.Angelica(12:54:37): One thing that can help you with this issue is a signal repeaterAngelica(12:55:13): this will allow your signal to reach some areas better and will allow to to have a stronger wirless signalsryu(12:58:26): I heard that 802.11n should solve this issue? I actually have an apple extreme airport with 11n and it seems to give much stronger signal.. Unfortunately, it can only work through the verizon unit and the latter is now the bottleneck.Angelica(13:01:36): I understand and yes an N router does have a stronger signal unfortunately we are only able to test the Verizon router for any issues, have you tried to powercycle the router?sryu(13:03:06): You mean turning on and off? Sometimes, when the speed bogges down, I do it and it seems to improve for a while... At times it is a matter of having the internet work or not at all...Angelica(13:05:46): What can also be done is a full router reset, but this will be resetting the router back to factory default settings. I do not know if your second router may need extra settings but this could help with you issuesryu(13:07:54): I tried it recently, and I cannot judge whether it improved the situation or not..Angelica(13:10:36): I have ran some tests on my sideAngelica(13:10:47): unfortunately all appears to be correctsryu(13:10:56): I just ran the speed test, and it gave me 1.9 Mbps download, and quality of service 14 %. This is done in a room quite close to the router, much better than the room I normally work in.Angelica(13:11:37): If you have reset the router the last test to be made is to test the router itself and check the signal it is getting through an ethernet cable only to test this is not a low signalsryu(13:13:48): I don't get your last message?Angelica(13:14:48): I apologize if I was not clear, if you connect directly to the router through an ethernet cable, what speed do you get?sryu(13:16:19): I have never used the ethernet connection on my machines. So, I don't know at the moment...sryu(13:17:43): I have a Macbook air, which does not even have the standard ethernet inlet, and my other desktop machine is on a different floor of the house. The router is on the second floor, which is midway between all rooms that need the internet.Angelica(13:20:06): I understand unfortunately, we are unable to assure wireless signal since we can not control how the signal gets to your computerssryu(13:21:09): When the unit was first installed, I used to get the signal in the range btwn 10 - 20 Mbps, for which I am paying. It is now deteriorate to a fraction of it. Should I continue with the service?sryu(13:22:05): Does Verizon FiOS offer a 802-11n capable routers to any customers?Angelica(13:24:01): Yes we do but this is only for business customers if you would like more information on this I can transfer you to our billing department for further informationsryu(13:25:06): Does it even offer one with 802-11b/g option? I need to know if my unit is up-to-date on par with other customers on the same package.sryu(13:25:55): Or I'd rather seek ways to use Apple airport directly for the service.Angelica(13:26:38): Unfortunately I would not have this information, but they will be able to answer these questionsAngelica(13:26:48): would you like me to transfer you to them?sryu(13:29:00): So what is your suggestion for my package now other than upgrading to the business package?Angelica(13:32:06): If you would like to upgrade to an N router they would be able to assist you with checking what service would be best for youAngelica(13:32:26): I wish I could provide you with more information on this, but I do not have thissryu(13:32:49): then let me talk to people with the information pleaseAngelica(13:35:29): I will gladly, give me only a moment while I make this transferThis session is being transferred. (13:36:24)This session is transferred to Marilyn. (13:36:24)Agent Marilyn has joined. (13:36:24)Marilyn(13:36:36): Hello. Thank you for choosing Verizon and visiting our chat service. I will be happy to help you today.sryu(13:37:10): Do you have access to my previous session with Angelica?Marilyn(13:37:55): Yes, i am reviewing it now.Marilyn(13:38:51): I see that you are having problems with your internet connection, and would like to order a router.sryu(13:41:04): I am on 25 Mbps or higher package and am getting only 1.9 Mbps recently. It used to work much better until recently. But with all other gadgets, and signals from neighbors and etc, it is now past due to move along with the new protocols. Currently, my unit is 802-11b, which is clearly not capable with dealing with all the noises.Marilyn(13:41:45): I apologize for the trouble that you are having.sryu(13:42:52): We are now passing 1 hour mark since I started the session...Marilyn(13:43:52): I can understand your frustration.Marilyn(13:44:23): Are you wanting to order a router?sryu(13:45:35): I want Verizon to replace the existing router with either a 802-11b/g at least or -11n, so that I can get what is advertised reliably.sryu(13:46:33): I can be a little more patient if I am getting 15 Mbps when I am paying for 25, but getting < 2 Mbps is unacceptible.Marilyn(13:49:23): I can understand, however you will need to speak with technical support or make changes to your account.sryu(13:49:52): What do you mean by making changes to your account?Marilyn(13:50:32): By adding additional equipment as advised by technical support.sryu(13:50:49): At my cost?Your session is now closed.Thank you, have a nice day.

Gold Contributor VII
Justin
Posts: 4,880
Registered: ‎08-05-2008

Re: When will Verizon deploy 802.11n capable routers?


sryu wrote:

Here is a recent chat session which was abruptly terminated by the agent after 1+ hour. leading nowhere....  

It may look long and messy, but reading through it for a few minutes will save you an hour of your time. If anybody got a better outcome on the issue, please let me know!


Do you REALLY expect anyone to read that????? My goodness, if you feel the need to post stuff like that, at least take the time to format it! I have no idea whether I might be sympathetic with whatever your issue is, but I for one am absolutely not going to waste my time trying to read that.

 

Just a suggestion..... :smileyhappy:

 

__________________________________
Justin
FiOS TV, Internet, and phone user
QIP7232, IMG 1.8, Build 02.54
Keller, TX 76248

 

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