We had been experiencing daily Internet outages and slow Internet speeds with Verizon DSL since at least April 2009. We have tried repeatedly to have Verizon fix the problem. Tech support kept blaming our equipment and therefore we purchased a new modem from Verizon and also a new router. These did not fix the problem. On August 8th Verizon tech support finally stated the lines were “not up to their standards” Verizon repair has been out 3 times now to try to fix the problem. Each time something is band-aided in the Verizon equipment, another problem is found. 44 days after Verizon admitted the problem was in their equipment we still are experiencing daily problems. We are still waiting for the most recent repair that was determined necessary 12 days ago.
For six months of abysmal service we have paid a total of $126 and are out of pocket $86 for a modem and about $75 for a router.
A more detailed account of our experience:
In the early spring of 2009 we began to experience intermittent problems with our Verizon DSL service. We would often lose service or the Internet connection would become extremely slow. We called Verizon Tech support several times and were always told the problem must be on our end: our computers, our modem, router, DSL filters, etc.. Here is a summary starting in April of our attempts to have our DSL fixed.
April 2009, Verizon tech support suggested our existing modem might be bad. We purchased a new modem from Verizon for $86.03. However our DSL problems continued despite the new modem.
May 2009, DSL problems continue and became more frequent. We call tech support and are told the problem must be with the settings on the computer. The tech rep talks us through making numerous setting changes on the computer. These setting changes did not fix the DSL problems but did it fact screw up the computer. Also, suddenly now we could no longer connect to our old router so our other household computers could not go on the Internet. Verizon support said all of this was not their problem and blamed it on the router. Funny it was working fine until then. After several days of our own efforts and purchasing a new router, we got the computer working properly again, and we were back on the Internet with all our computers. However DSL problems continued unabated, and now we were out of pocket for a new modem and router.
Periodically over the next few weeks as we had DSL outages, we would call tech support. Each time they blamed our equipment. Each time during the phone call somehow the Internet came back. At one point the tech rep said he detected something wrong with the line to our house. We were told they would work on that problem and call us back. We never got any call back. No one ever came out to fix anything.
Eventually we came to realize that we did not have to call tech support to restore the Internet. The mere act of picking up a phone in the house and starting to dial any number restored service. We limped along with this band-aid fix for weeks.
August 7, 2009: The opposite problem occurred. Picking up a phone caused us to lose the Internet. We disconnected every phone in the house. We then individually plugged in single phones with its own DSL filter, trying each phone with no other phones plugged in. Every time we lost the Internet and regained it when hanging up the phone. Therefore unless all of our DSL filters had suddenly gone bad, it was not the filters. With all phones disconnected and the modem going direct to our main computer, we called Verizon tech support using a cell phone. As tech support was checking the line we demonstrated how we lost signal by plugging in a phone. Tech support ran a line test and said the line had an intermittent problem. They then did a 24-hour line test.
August 8, 2009: Verizon automated call stating our line was “not up to their standards” and they would send out a repairman.
August 12, 2009: Verizon repairman arrives, diagnoses “cross ring” and something about tips grounding. He hooks us up to a different distribution pair. Gives me local number to call if problem persists.
August 14, 2009: Still losing Internet periodically and experiencing dramatic slow downs. Used PCPitstop as demonstrated by repairman to check ping, download and upload speed. Results: Ping 154 ms, download 27 kbps, and upload 302 kbps. Should be ping about 39 ms, download about 1000 kbps, and upload 360 kbps. Called local Verizon Repair office to report.
August 15 – 18, 2009: Internet terrible, no contact from Verizon.
August 19, 2009: My phone call finally returned. Repairman says he will call main office and try to have “meet” point reset.
August 20 through 24, 2009: Service still terrible on daily basis. Other examples of speed: 1937 ms ping, download 270 kbps, upload 318 kpbs, another time ping 49 ms, download 253 kbps, upload 289 kpbs. Cycling modem off then on will often restore speed.
August 24, 2009: Called local office and left messages to report continued problems and inquire if “meet point: was ever reset.
August 25, 2009: Repairman here again. No “meet point” was ever reset. While here he got ping of 154 ms, download 27 kbps, upload 317 kpbs. He said he was surprised we did not lose connectivity when the download speed dropped under 32 kpbs. He did another line test and got another cross ring. He leaves to change distribution pairs again. An hour later he calls and says he had already switched us to the best distribution pair, all other pairs are worse. He needs to get a cable tech out in the next few days to work on the problem with him. It had become pretty apparent to us the problems have ALWAYS been degraded, old Verizon lines and NOT our computers, filters, modem, router, etc.
August 25 to September 9th: Internet problems continue, no sign of any Verizon work being done.
September 9 and 10th: Left messages for repairman to find out what is happening.
September 10, 2009: Repairman shows up. Turns out no repair work was done as promised since Aug. 25th.. Repairman now wants to get into Verizon box across the street buried under a neighbor’s shrubbery. I contact neighbor that evening and they cut back shrubs that weekend.
September 14, 2009: Called repairman directly and tell him box is now clear.
September 15 to 21, 2009: Internet problems continuing, no sign of Verizon. Scattered lose dirt still undisturbed on box cover. Band-aid fixes applied daily: cycling modem on and then off to restore speed, dialing phone to restore Internet when lost. Usually this works but not always.
Note: The Verizon repairman seems to be trying his best. I blame Verizon corporate for a policy of not being willing to adequately repair or replace their DSL equipment. Verizon’s focus is on FiOS that is not available to us. Consequently Verizon DSL is abysmal because their repair crews are overwhelmed and are not being authorized to make the necessary repairs.
Solved! Go to Correct Answer
Good news finally – DSL appears to be working fine for the last week!
Here’s what happened since my last post:
I called Tech Support the evening of 10/6 to see if I could get them to issue a new work ticket that I hoped would increase the odds that the Verizon repairman would return at last (had been waiting a week and counting since I left first message for him that the problem persisted). Of course Tech Support tells me there is nothing wrong with the line because it is testing fine at the moment I am calling. Duh. I tell them that this is an intermittent problem that their repairman is quite familiar with, and all I am trying to do is to get him back out to do the next thing he wanted to try. The best tech support will do is order a 24 hour line test, and if that comes up bad, a work ticket will be issued. Fine.
Next morning I get an automated message that the 24-hour line test is in progress, and that in the mean time some settings (no specifics) have been changed that should improve my service.
Shortly after, the repairman is knocking at the door. He is there due to my 2 phone messages to him, not due to tech support. Got an explanation for the long delays between his visits. Each time after his initial visit, he has been coming by without a work ticket and fitting my problem in between other jobs. The reason for this is that if more work tickets are issued after an initial repair, the repairman gets a ding on his record for not fixing it the first time. The fact that an intermittent problem like cross rings can only be fixed by doing a repair, then seeing if that completely does the trick, is not taken into account by management.
So this time he did work in the house, hooking the DSL to the 3rd phone line in the house. Learned something new – while my house can have 2 phone lines (we just use one now), there is a 3rd line coming into the house which is not hooked up at any of the wall jacks. Apparently I cannot actually use this 3rd line for a separate phone number due to something about the service for this neighborhood. So now the DSL is not on the same phone line as the phones in the house, and it is on its own line.
The good news is that since doing this last repair, I have not noticed any more problems! It would appear there was a source of more cross rings in the main phone line within the house.
Recapping then, there were three different problems all of which caused intermittent cross rings screwing up the service:
1) the distribution pair was bad
2) the connections is the box across the street were corroded
3) the main phone line in the house has problems sufficient to screw up DSL, but not bad enough to disrupt basic phone service.
At the end of the day of this last repair, I got another automated message that the 24-hour line test was complete. My line was “not up to their standards”, and I should call to schedule a repair. I will just let that go unless problems reappear.
I will give it another week, and if all goes well I will call this case solved.
SOME ADVICE TO OTHERS:
DSL problems can be intermittent so if tech support tests your line OK while you are on the phone with them, insist on a 24-hour line test. Then make sure the test is actually done. You will get an automated call with the results.
If an Internet outage can be fixed by dialing your phone, or slow speed improved by cycling the modem off, then on, the problem is intermittent cross rings caused by problems with Verizon equipment. Don’t let tech support blame your computer, DSL filters, etc.. In my case, dialing the phone to call tech support would temporarily fix the problem. Each time then tech support would detect no problem with the line during the phone call and blame my equipment.
The lines for Verizon DSL are pretty old; there may be multiple problem areas, so keep hounding them until they are fixed.
Wow. I might not use Verizon. That's horrible.
#1 What is the brand and model of your current modem?
#2 What is the brand and model of your current router?
Modem is a Westell 6100F purchased fron Verizon
Router is D-Link DIR825
Update: I did yesterday after 45 minutes waiting for a billing supervisor get Verizon to give me a credit of 4 months of DSL service. I also left a message yesterday with the Verizon repairman to see when, or if, he will ever be working on the box across the street as promised. No one call back either yesterday or today.
@DSLDisaster wrote:Modem is a Westell 6100F purchased fron Verizon
Router is D-Link DIR825
Ok.
#1 In your modem, is modem Status. Please post them.
#2 If you have no idea of what I mean and since I have no idea of how old or new your Westell 6100F is..
a) Over at All DSLR (dslreports.com)FAQs » Verizon Online DSL FAQ » Hardware »How do I use a router with the Westell 6100?
They speak of the White and Blue Westell Firmware and the Red and Black Firmware.
b) Please only answer my question (DO not attempt to do what is told over there, if you have not already did what is told over at that FAQ - at this time).
Which one do you have?
#3 In your D-Link DIR825, go to Advanced -> Advanced Network.
#4 If you do not have at least two game consoles behind this router, turn off UPnP in the router.
Note - By game console: Xbox, PlayStation.
#5 In your D-Link DIR825, go to Setup -> Wireless Settings -> Manual Wireless Network Setup.
#6 Is Wireless in the router enabled?
#7 Is any Wireless Security Mode set?
Please note: Since this a dual Wireless, please answer for both (2.4GHz and 5GHz).
I went to the link you provided and read the info. My modem apparently has the red and black firmware. I purchased it from Verizon in April 2009. Did not realize it was also a router. I found 2 modem status that I will paste in below. I don't know why one has the broadband connection type as bridge, the other screen has the connection type as routed.
FYI fooling with settings computers is not something I have much experience with, so bear with me.
I haven't yet gotten into the the info you wanted from my router.
Repairman update, he came today and found the connections in the box across the street were very corroded. He replaced them so now I am in a wait and see mode if I still have problems.
Modem Status
Software Version:
VER:5.01.00.01
Transceiver Revision:
7.2.3.0
Model Name:
F90-610015-06
Serial Number:
09AK01062681
Broadband Connection Status:
UP
Broadband IP Address:
{edited for privacy}
Broadband MAC Address:
{edited for privacy}
Broadband Connection Type:
Bridge
Active Status:
00:00:00
Configuration:
096-900175-01 A
Modem Status
GO!
Your Modem is Ready for Internet Access
Internet Status: Connected
DSL link: Connected
Speed (Down/Up):
1184 Kbits/sec by 448 Kbits/sec
Connection Type: Routed
Username:
IP Address:
{edited for privacy}
Ok, the info that I am looking for is at System Monitoring -> Advanced Status -> Transciever Stats.
I appreciate your assistance in case there is another issue going on in addition to the confrimed Verizon equipment problems.
Here is the information you requested:
Transceiver Statistics
Transceiver Revision: 7.2.3.0 Vendor ID Code: 4 Line Mode: G.DMT Mode Data Path: Interleaved Transceiver Information Downstream Path Upstream Path DSL Speed (Kbits/Sec) 1184 448 Margin (dB) 10.0 14.0 Line Attenuation (dB) 60.0 31.5 Transmit Power (dBm) 15.9 11.9
Repair updates: Still having internet drop out, just did it again between posts! Restored by dialing phone.
According to the repairman, if the internet drops out and can be restored by dialing the phone it can mean only one thing - a cross ring in the line. He explained to me that dialing the phone sends a burst of energy down the lines that temporarily pushes through the cross ring. Cross rings occur when 2 wires that should not be touching, are touching. You have a similar situation to this in electric wiring and that causes a short. Cross rings can be intermittent, which the ones of our these lines are. Therefore Verizon can test your lines and say they are good - but in actuality they are only testing good at that moment.
The repairman has already fixed 2 areas that would have caused cross rings but obviously there are still more! Looks like I will be calling him back. Apparently the only way to fix these is to do one repair at a time, then wait to see if more cross rings occur. This is very time consuming, and considering the degraded condition of the Verizon lines, who knows how many other problem spots will be found.
I have already been told that Verizon will not replace lines, only repair and patch. As I said in my first post, I think this is because their focus is on FiOS and not maintaining the DSL.
Isn't it ironic that there are all these problems in the lines when for months Verizon had blamed my computer, modem, DSL filters, etc.!
Also according to the repairman, my being able to restore speed when the internet slows to a crawl by cycling the modem off and on could signify one the following: 1) cross ring, 2) my modem failing (just bought it this April from Verizon), 3) the circuit being overcrowded with other users.
Assuming it is not my new modem, and it is the cross ring problem, I am thinking cycling the modem does the same thing as dialing the phone to temporarily fix the cross ring. If the problem is overcrowded circuits, cycling the modem can help because according to the repairman this is something similar to changing your location in the crowd to a better spot. For those of us that are not very tech savvy, I am thinking of this like being moved to the head of the queue. If overcrowding is the problem with the slow speeds (download 1014 slowed to 27 at the worst!), so much for the old TV adds suggesting this only happens on cable so that was why you should get DSL!
As I have been typing this post, the internet has been dropping out every few minutes!
I will keep posting updates so anyone else having Verizon DSL problems can benefit from what I am learning.
Start a new topic or ask questions in the open forum.
