STB WAN fail - no guide info

[destman]

So this is kind of a weird issue I'm having.  I initially had residential fios tv service and business internet (5 static ip's).  Everything was working fine for a couple of years.  About 2 weeks I cancelled my business internet and signed up for a triple play bundle, including 75/35 residential internet.

About a week after the switch, I noticed that I have no more guide and program information (i have 2 DVR boxes, both acting the same).  After power cycling everything in every order possible, and being on the phone with techs several times, they sent me a new router.  That didn't fix the problem.  Not sure what to do.

So, internet works fine, TV is fine but no data (guide, widgets, etc).

Diagnostics on the boxes show it is connectied on coax LAN (getting 192.169.1.100 and 192.168.1.101 respectively) but failing WAN test.

It must be some setting that needs to be updated when switching the internet from business to residential.  I assume that i didn't notice it right after the switch because some data had already been cached.  All the techs i've talked to have no idea.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[armond_in_nj1]

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@destman wrote:

 ... had residential fios tv service and business internet (5 static ip's) ... signed up for a triple play bundle, including 75/35 residential internet ... noticed that I have no more guide and program information ... they sent me a new router.  That didn't fix the problem ... Diagnostics on the boxes show it is connected on coax LAN (getting 192.169.1.100 and 192.168.1.101 respectively) but failing WAN test ...

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Can you give some idea of your network components and in particular your wiring diagram?

[destman]

ONT is connected to router via Ethernet

router is connected to STB's via coax (not sure if it's via ONT or not)

There are a couple of splitters here and there, but nothing has been changed for years in the wiring setup, and everything used to work fine until recently.

[armond_in_nj1]

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@destman wrote:

ONT is connected to router via Ethernet

router is connected to STB's via coax (not sure if it's via ONT or not)

There are a couple of splitters here and there, but nothing has been changed for years in the wiring setup, and everything used to work fine until recently.

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In general you need to have WAN coax to obtain guide data.  This is a simple change that can be accomplished over the telephone, and it generally does not require a truck roll.  Note that in the past there were indeed installations using both coax and Ethernet from the ONT, but I don't believe that is still common.

I recently discussed a similar situation on these boards, so it may help to take a look at the wiring diagrams in this post:

http://forums.verizon.com/t5/FiOS-TV-Technical-Assistance/Unplugging-all-network-devices-from-Fios-r...

[destman]

Ok, so I traced the wires.

         | ---- ethernet ----> ROUTER --coax----->(out)|                         | (out)----coax---> STB1

ONT |                                                                              | 3way splitter |

         |---- coax ----------------------------------------->(in)|                         | (out)----coax---> STB2

This setup was in place and working perfectly for over 2 years with business internet.  When I switched over to residential internet, they didn't change any wiring, just activated the new internet account via their in home agent thing.

So, while non-standard, the wiring setup definitely should work, since it was working before the switch to residential. 

Would it be possible for them to have had both the coax and the ethernet turned on in the ONT?  Maybe it was like that before and that's why it worked, although I would think that all the communication would just have to go through the router anyway, to use the DHCP.

[armond_in_nj1]

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destman wrote:

 ... I traced the wires.

         | ---- ethernet ----> ROUTER --coax----->(out)|                         | (out)----coax---> STB1

ONT |                                                                              | 3way splitter |

         |---- coax ----------------------------------------->(in)|                         | (out)----coax---> STB2

This setup was in place and working perfectly for over 2 years with business internet.  When I switched over to residential internet, they didn't change any wiring ... So, while non-standard, the wiring setup definitely should work, since it was working before the switch to residential ...

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Your diagram does not specifically indicate that the router is connected by coax to the splitter (although that's perhaps the case).  The router must connect by coax to the ONT to get data.

I would not be inclined to conclude that the earlier wiring configuration is necessarily correct for your present needs, only that whatever worked earlier, worked earlier.  If the router does have a path to the ONT (not obvious from the diagram), then there is something amiss with the wiring between the router and the ONT.  The Ethernet wiring is at best superfluous, and at worst totally wrong.  It's also possible (perhaps even likely) that you were never switched to WAN coax.  This is easy to test: simply unplug a few wires and see if you get online.

While I'm not conversant with the differences between "business" and "residential" Internet, the configuration you want is that referenced in my earlier post, and detailed below:

                                             ONT | ---- coax ----------| 3way splitter |

                                                                                           |

                                                                                           | ----- STB1

                                                                                           | ----- STB2

                                                                                           |

                                                                                           | ----- Router

                                                                                                       |

                                                                                                       | Ethernet (wired)

    

[destman]

My setup is just like you describe except there is also a direct ethernet wire from the ONT to the router.

I never had WAN coax, I have WAN Ethernet.  That has not been a problem in the past.  Ethernet was the preferred method of connection, and it actually yields higher data transfer rates.

[armond_in_nj1]

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@destman wrote:

My setup is just like you describe except  ... I have WAN ... and it actually yields higher data transfer rates ...

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" ... just like you describe except ... " means it's different.  Also unless you are at the very highest data tier, you do not require WAN Ethernet.  As I stated earlier:

"The router must connect by coax to the ONT to get data."

If you want the guide data you have asked for, may I suggest that you call Verizon, switch to WAN coax (done over the phone), and simply rewire as I have indicated.  If you'd rather approach this issue differently, I'm afraid I'm at a loss for additional suggestions.

[destman]

It is indeed different, it has the additional Ethernet connection between the router and the ONT.  So the router is connected to the ONT by both coax and ethernet.

If I was indeed at the highest data tier, then I would have the WAN Ethernet connection anyway.  So the guide, widgets, etc on the STBs would have to work with that setup, just like they did for me before.

Anyway, I really do appreciate the time you have put into providing these answers, and if I get no other answers from other users or from Verizon - I will just switch over to coax WAN like you suggest and see if that fixes the problem.  Thanks again!

[Justin46]

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@destman wrote:

It is indeed different, it has the additional Ethernet connection between the router and the ONT.  So the router is connected to the ONT by both coax and ethernet.

If I was indeed at the highest data tier, then I would have the WAN Ethernet connection anyway.  So the guide, widgets, etc on the STBs would have to work with that setup, just like they did for me before.

Anyway, I really do appreciate the time you have put into providing these answers, and if I get no other answers from other users or from Verizon - I will just switch over to coax WAN like you suggest and see if that fixes the problem.  Thanks again!

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I am a 7 year user of FiOS and I have my internet connection via Ethernet between the router and the ONT, and it works just fine. Here is my network:

If you ignore the dotted box in the upper right, I think my network looks very much like the one the OP has. And everything works just fine.

Going back through the thread, it appears that:

1) The STBs have acquired valid IP addresses from the router, so that connection is just fine, no changes needed.

2) The router has a WAN IP address from the FiOS network, because the internet works, so that is just fine, but.... Question: when you log into the router and look at the connection status, does it show Ethernet? Here is mine (I have covered the last part of my IP address for privacy):

If it shows Ethernet, then that is how your internet traffic is sent and received. If it shows coax, then the Ethernet connection is not being used at all. You can ignore the PPPoE for Connecttion Type, yours may say DHCP.

3) Now since the STBs show WAN failure, yet the router does have WAN access, that means to me the problem is some thing wrong in a definition in the router. I had some problems with the router occasionally trying to switch from Ethernet to Coax, so I disabled the WAN Coax connection:

Since the button says Enable, the connection is disabled. And if I go to this screen, I see:

One last thing: you might go look at the router log to see if you see anything that looks wrong:

I would look for any messages regarding WAN connetion problems.

All of this is to say, I think you need to go into the router and check the WAN definitions and see if you are actually using the Ethernet connection to the ONT vs. the coax, and whether the coax WAN connection is disabled. If not, I suggest you disable it and see what happens (if things don't work any better you can always set it back). If you see something that doesn't look right, tell us what it is and maybe something will jump out to somebody (even maybe to me).

I don't know if this helps at all, but I know for sure that you can use the Ethernet for internt on a home (non-business) setup, and the STBs can get their Guide info, Widgets, etc.

__________________________________
Justin
FiOS TV, 25/25 Internet, and Digital Voice user
QIP7232, QIP7100-P2, IMG 1.9.1
Keller, TX 76248